General FAQ
From VG-8.com
[edit] What are the differences between the various models of the VG-8?
What the VG-8EX or VG-8 w/S1 expansion has that the VG-8 doesn't:
- Four new instrument models including the long-awaited "hollow-body" model for acoustic and acoustic/electric sounds
- Seven new pickup models: Tele, PAF, P-90, Rickenbacker and more
- Three new amp models: Soldano, master volume Marshall and Vox combo
- Three new speaker models: 4x10 open back, modern stack, British combo
- New effects: pedal-assignable "intelligent" pitch shifting and wah-wah
- There are 32 new patches in a preset "E" bank (EX only)
What the VG-88 v2 has that the VG-88 v1 doesn't:
- 3 new COSM guitar models: Wave Synth, Sitar and Nylon II
- 18 new COSM amp models including combos and stacks from vintage to modern
- Defretter effect creates instant fretless guitar sounds
- Uni-V effect produces vintage swirling rotary sounds
- New COSM wah modeling re-creates 5 classic wah pedals
- Auto GK Detection means you don't have to change setup menu stuff when you use more than one GK-equipped guitar.
- External control now possible via System Exclusive messages
Here's another take:
What the VG-8EX has that the VG-88 doesn't:
- Uses Memory Cards via card slot
- Has "Autotune" (pitch shifting detuned strings back into tune)
- Acoustic model has more parameters
- All guitar models can be pitch shifted, unlike the 88, which only lets you shift some of the guitar models
- MIDI implementation more flexible (someone know further details? Still true vs. VG-88 v2?)
- Has the following models that the VG-88 lacks:
- ...
VG-88 vs. VG-8EX
- Built in expression pedal
- Can accept output from regular magnetic (non-hexaphonic) pickups
- Has the following models that the VG-8EX lacks:
- Nylon Guitar
- Sitar (v2)
- ...
- Non-detachable power cord
- 32 amp models (v2)
Here’s yet another take:
Major differences: The 8 is much more flexible as a synth, largely because it has global per-string pitch changing (i.e., no matter what algorithm you're in, you can always access all the pitch-change options; NOT true on the 88; this means ANY tone you can come up with on the 8 can be taken into bizarre new sonic territory with pitchshifting). You can also crossfade from unshifted to shifted pitches with an expression pedal (they call this “blending;” pitch-bending is also possible), which adds enormously to the expressive potential.
The 88 is arguably more versatile for guitar/amp emulations. If you're gigging in a cover band, for example, you'll find the 88 gives you great guitar sounds (It’s a later version of COSM). It has a pretty usable nylon emulation. It also has better envelope control in its percussive-attack synth model, making limited kalimba- and xylophone-esque tones possible. The 88 also has much deeper modulation options.
Unique and interesting non-traditional sounds are extensively possible on both of these incomparable units. But the limited pitch-shifting thing on the 88 is a deal breaker, IMO, if you’re not going to get both devices. If you’re more interested in crafting unique new guitar sounds than in getting the best guitar/amp simulations, I'd go with the 8 without hesitation. If you're less interested in sounding like a synthesizer and more interested in sounding like your favorite guitarist, the 88 would probably be your best choice. (David Coffin, Mooncaine, et al)
[edit] Can I use the VG-x and another GK device (VG-x, GR-30, GR-09, GI-10, Axon, etc.) simultaneously?
Yes you can. You need to invest in the Roland US-20 Unit Selector. Note to RMC Poly Drive I users, this unit needs to be modified for use with your pickups.
For those able to build electronic equipment themselves, there is a DIY safe clone here
You may also use a GKP-4, a four-units-in-parallel device. Some users have reported that the US-20 has exhibited problems with noise, whereas when they move to the GKP-4, the noises are reduced or eliminated. The difference is that the GKP-4 has no switching - every output port is always on, whereas the US-20 has foot switches to select either one or both output ports.
[edit] What are piezo pickups?
Piezo (short for piezoelectric) pickups are devices based on "piezoelectric effect". They are usually made of a very thin slab of piezoelectric material (mainly ceramics) that, when flexed, is able to generate a very little current proportional to the energy (string vibration) that drives them. They ONLY WORK BY DIRECT CONTACT with the vibrating object they're designed to amplify, and are capable of transducing a huge amount of information (from very low to very high frequencies), that's why several list members are worried about piezo on tremolo units (hitting the whammy bar can cause a low frequency noise). Piezo is the technology behind a lot of items, from cigarette ligters to the famous C-ducer pickups.
[edit] Which should I buy? The VG-x or GR-x?
It depends on what you want to accomplish. The GR-x is a pitch-to-MIDI guitar synth, the VG-x is NOT!! The GR-x can produce more traditional sounds like trumpets, piano, drums, which the VG-x doesn't. The VG-x on the other hand, is a billion times more sensitive to play feel and subtleties in your playing than the GR-30. Since it works on the sound of your strings, you can do things like scratch your strings or bang your guitar and you will get sound, with the GR-x, the unit will just be confused.
The GRs CONVERT the hex-pickup output signal into a MIDI note-on/off event, which can then be sent to any MIDI-accessible sound device, be it a built-in synth tone, a hardware synth or sampler, or any soft-synth. As implied above, this means that you have to play very cleanly to ensure accurate pitch detection for the audio-to-MIDI conversion. You're simply using your guitar instead of some other MIDI triggering device (like a keyboard) to trigger the same kinds of sounds...and suffering with the fact that a vibrating string is not an ideal MIDI trigger. The VGs, on the other hand, use the unconverted AUDIO signal from the hex pickup output to drive their physical-modeling algorithms, allowing any sort of string excitation and any playing technique to produce a sound. This can inspire you to expand your repertoire of playing techniques rather than forcing you to restrict them. So, while you’re limited to the small but rich range of synth algorithms Roland has deigned to include in their VG units (fwiw, I’ve gotten very usable trumpet- and drum-like sounds from my 8:), I’d go so far as to assert that the VGs are the only TRUE guitar synths around. (David Coffin)
[edit] How well does the VG-x track?
The VG-x doesn't "track" in the traditional sense of the word. It is actually processing effects on your actual string sound, not converting that sound into MIDI data. Speed metal players have no problem fitting in all those random notes! :)
[edit] Can I get a wireless unit for the VG-x?
Currently THERE ARE NO SUCH UNITS unless you're ready to invest a lot of cash in a professional multichannel box (like the ones used for TV but heavily modified). The GK/Piezo out (13 pin connector) is made of 6 wires carrying AUDIO from the 6 strings, not midi or some digitalized stuff. In order to go wireless we need a 6 channel unit (7 if you also use the "regular" guitar out) plus several switches.
There is a DIY development project underway here. Active co-developers are welcome!
[edit] What's a good price for a VG-8x new or used?
The resale price of any VG-8x varies, but it can usually be found on eBay for less than $400, and at larger music chain stores for about that amount. If you do purchase a used unit, always ask for the manual. If you don't get one, it can be downloaded from www.rolandus.com.
[edit] What is the best type of amplifier to use with the VG systems?
In general, you don't want to use a regular guitar amp, you want an amp with a fuller spectrum, for instance a keyboard amplifier.
[edit] Does a given VG patch sound different when played via a nylon string guitar (Godin Multiac) vs. an electric guitar?
Certainly there are differences. The nylon pluck is different enough from the sound of electric string that processing it will not produce the same result. So, while the sound you get from the VG-8x when using a nylon hexaphonic may not be what the sound designer intended, it still will probably be a very interesting sound. ie. The Les Paul won't be convincing, but may sound cool!
A subjective comparison of Nylon vs. Electric by M. Stephenson:
I have a Godin Grand Concert SA (nylon strings and RMC piezzo bridge - "Nylon") and a Burrell double cutaway electric to which I installed a GK-3 ("Electric"). I also have both a VG-8s1 and a VG-88v2.
The Nylon: sounds best with acoustic and jazz patches. Acoustic patches are much more realistic sounding on the Nylon than on the Electric, same holds true for many of the Jazz sounds. The electric guitar patches tend to be darker sounding and lacking an edge. Most of the VG-88v2 electric guitar patches did not sound very impressive with the Nylon. I think the Nylon sounds best when paired with the VG-8s1.
The Electric: sounds best with electric patches and some acoustic patches (especially the VG-8s1 mandolin). Many of the acoustic patches have a metallic edge and do not sound realistic, especially the nylon and flamenco patches. Some Jazz guitar patches lacked the warmth of the Nylon, but some others sounded better. Many of the VG-88v2 Jazz patches sounded better on the Electric than on the Nylon. The electric patches are awesome. I think the Electric sounds best when parired with the VG-88v2.
I had actually considered selling the VG-88v2 after getting the VG-8s1, at which time I only owned the Nylon. A few months later I got the Electric and when I hooked it up to the VG-88v2 I fell in love with it all over again. The difference between a Nylon and Electric guitar on the VG-88v2 was very noticeable. The difference between the two guitars did not seem as prominent on the VG-8s1, but I paired it with the Nylon for the acoustic and jazz sounds.
From a tracking point of view, I did not really notice any difference between the two guitars on either of the VG units. However, I think that the RMC system on the Nylon works better when I am using my GI-20 for recording/triggering MIDI. I did spend a good bit of time to get the GK-3 installed properly and to get the parameters in both VG units set properly, and I think this is important for proper triggering. - M. Stephenson
[edit] Is there anything available for for the Bass player?
Yes, Roland makes the V-Bass for all of you bass players out there. It is based on the VG-88 and it can handle a 4, 5, or 6 string bass. It looks like a silver VG-88 and if you open it up you will find that one of the boards has both VG-88 and V-Bass stamped on it. Roland also makes a GK-2B pickup for installation on a bass.
